Comments on: Formalizing informal learning? https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/ Clark Quinn's learnings about learning Fri, 05 Mar 2010 08:51:15 +0000 hourly 1 By: Learning: traditional or independent? https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88567 Fri, 05 Mar 2010 08:51:15 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88567 […] Formalizing informal learning (Clark Quinn) […]

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By: February Informal Learning Hotlist https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88421 Mon, 01 Mar 2010 22:39:00 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88421 […] Formalizing informal learning?- Learnlets, February 16, 2010 […]

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By: Clark https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88137 Mon, 22 Feb 2010 15:11:18 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88137 Neil, I don’t get your complaint. I’m suggesting that the role is to:

a) provide tools

b) support effective tool use (evangelizing, nurturing, observing)

c) support self- and other-learning skills

I think there *is* a role for someone to look at what’s produced and potentially redesign for clarity, and also see where a course could help, but that’s a role for transfer from informal to performance support or formal. As I said, I like the notion of Steve’s playground: we put up a mix of different things, and our only responsibility is to have them play fair and safely, not to dictate what they play on and when.

From the Cynefin framework, I think it’s a case of Probe-Sense-Respond, looking for emergent patterns.

And as for work/life, I’ll quote Harold Jarche: work is learning, and learning is work. Life? As part of your trusting folks, I reckon they’ll be doing informal learning at work, and you just want to make sure they’ve got good tools.

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By: Paul Simbeck-Hampson https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88125 Sun, 21 Feb 2010 22:56:22 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88125 @Steve – Thanks, will update my posts :-)

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By: Steve https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88112 Sun, 21 Feb 2010 13:58:13 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88112 Expanding on the incomplete comment in response to Neil’s insightful response –

There seem to be other advantage to mediating and supporting a space in between the more pure forms of self-directed learning and the more formal forms of facilitated / programmed information and learning support. Let’s say I spend a lot of time digging, exploring, and internalizing new perspectives and skills. Without a mediated space (and precedent) to share and diffuse this acquisition in my distributed professional network it will stay with me.

To me the mediated informal space is for propagation. Simply supporting the space and encouraging participation is potentially motivation for folks to continue learning on their own, and in their own way. There is also plenty of value to the origin / source that is able to share in their professional environment.

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By: Steve https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88111 Sun, 21 Feb 2010 13:48:53 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88111 @Paul – surname is Flowers:)

@Neil – I’m with you – most (perhaps all) of my informal learning *occurs* on the life side. But there is a cycle where I drive the growth and the interests on both sides of work and home as well as the span in between. I have trouble completely compartmentalizing and segregating life / work, informal / formal. And I don’t think we should try so hard to do so, particularly if our job is fueled by our passion. There may be *pure* informal and this very well could be something that cannot be facilitated. But I DO believe that there is something in between pure informal and pure formal and THIS space very well CAN, and in most cases SHOULD, be supported (NOT CONTROLLED.)

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By: Neil Lasher https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88055 Fri, 19 Feb 2010 14:51:29 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88055 Maybe it’s Friday afternoon and I have been as productive as I am able to be this week already, but I am sorry I am just confused by this whole concept.

The term ‘informal’ was coined by a few of us, written about by Jay Cross and held the thought that if you learned by informally by ‘falling over’ something you found or asked another for and what you found or received helped you in some way and you both remembered it or acted upon it, then it was learning, informal learning. (sorry long sentence, Word would be underlining it in green)

I went down the route of developing an EPSS tool to assist in the delivery of informal snippets that had been left for the user to fall over intentionally http://www.trainer1.com/Rapid_Application_Support.html but to try to formalise it? Surely this then just becomes formal learning again. Something planned for you to do at a particular time and in a particular way. And you have been led by the hand to it…

Clark, to consider creating an infrastructure to support the user is great and I fully stand behind this idea as we should be attempting to make any learning easy to fall over, but to design it to a point where we are actually trying to direct the user to use the systems in the way we wish, not their own way, they will not use it in the the same way as if they had found it and worked it out for themselves. We all use blogs, twitter and facebook differently, but all get what we need from them.

There are a couple of issues I have. First we don’t give the staff enough credit for what they are able to work out and get on with by themselves. Always trying to lead them by the hand and do it ‘our way. Secondly I think we are relying too much on systems for systems sake…

Last thought http://lasher.co.uk I blogged yesterday an interesting idea of work life balance, informal learning is for me on the life side and not the work side. Maybe I have all wrong today? I will get off the soapbox!

Neil

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By: Paul Simbeck-Hampson https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88048 Fri, 19 Feb 2010 12:52:30 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88048 “blocking access to the internet seems to me to be a bit like giving someone an assembly task and then tying their hands.” < Nice.
"You want to enable smart work, not stifle it!" < That's it… some still don't want smart people, they people to react to commands :-(
Thanks for the timely advice – preparing for a new client meeting today, wish me luck :-)

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By: Clark https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88016 Thu, 18 Feb 2010 17:28:29 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88016 Paul, this came up last night where I spoke. Face it, most employees (at least knowledge workers), if they’re blocked through the firewall, will whip out their smartphone and get on the internet that way. And most cell-phones have browsers too these days (Bob Sanregret claims that there hasn’t been a cellphone sold in the past two years that doesn’t have one!).

I think there are ways to provide access outside the firewall (as some orgs do it) that don’t compromise the intranet. You do want to still have an intranet, I think, but blocking access to the internet seems to me to be a bit like giving someone an assembly task and then tying their hands. Particularly what Tony Karrer calls ‘concept workers’, and I think that’s more and more folks, or should be. You want to enable smart work, not stifle it!

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By: Paul Simbeck-Hampson https://blog.learnlets.com/2010/02/formalizing-informal-learning/#comment-88012 Thu, 18 Feb 2010 16:03:06 +0000 http://blog.learnlets.com/?p=1462#comment-88012 @Charlotte – Thanks for that question, it led to an interesting new post :-) @Clark.
@Steve – I love the playground concept too… (need a surname for citation)
@Clark – The increase in IT skills is widening. I see it being driven forward especially by the social media platforms like Facebook, Twitter and Ning (to name but a few). Skills learned on a home PC are also transferable into the work place. Web2.0 design helps bridge knowledge gaps to some extent which in-turn helps speed to proficiency. I often think one of the big issues in organisations is allowing employees access to the Internet – the firewall & security issues are big barrier’s to corporate learning. Do you have any advice how these security issue’s can be tackled?

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